90: Generational Trauma: How to Heal the Impact of Family & Parental Trauma

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Feb 21

Generational trauma can feel like a heavy burden, but so many people, myself included, feel guilty and shameful for feeling anything other than positive feelings and gratitude towards their family and cultures. Today I will be discussing generational trauma and how to heal from the impact of our parents and family’s unresolved trauma.

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We will focus on trauma that is passed down from our parents to us and how we can begin to break the cycle so we do not pass that trauma onto future generations. In this episode, I answer a question from a listener who sees the impact of their parents' unresolved trauma on their life and wants to break the cycle in order to not impact future generations with this trauma.

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What My Bones Know: A Memoir of Healing from Complex Trauma by: Stephanie Foo

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Timestamps ⏱️

Introduction: 00:14
Question 1: 01:37
Outro: 26:46

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This podcast was transcribed by an AI tool called Castmagic. Please forgive any typos or errors.
Amanda Durocher [00:00:01]:
Welcome to New View Advice. I'm your host, Amanda Durocher, and I invite you to join me here each week as I offer advice on how to move through whatever problem or trauma is holding you back from living life to the fullest. Let's get started. Hey there, beautiful soul. My name is Amanda Durocher, and this is New View Advice. If you're new here, this is a healing centered advice podcast where I offer guidance for the healing journey. I don't believe I have all the answers. I believe you have all the answers you seek.
Amanda Durocher [00:00:26]:
You just may need a new view and a little help along the way. Thank you for joining me for today's episode. Today, we'll be discussing generational trauma and how to heal from the impact of our parents' and families' unresolved trauma. Today, we will be specifically focusing on trauma that is passed down from our parents to us and how we can begin to break the cycle so we do not pass that trauma onto future generations and our own children. Generational trauma can feel like a heavy burden, but so many people, myself included, feel guilty and shameful feeling anything other than positive feelings and gratitude towards our families and our cultures. In this episode, I answer a question from a listener who sees the impact of their parents' unresolved trauma on their own life, and they wanna break the cycle in order to not impact future generations. My intention for this episode is to help you to begin your journey to healing generational trauma through a 3 step process that I'll describe throughout the episode. And before we jump in, I just wanted to mention that if you haven't checked out my website, I invite you to check it out after this episode for more free resources, including journal prompts, meditations, blog posts, and podcast episodes about the healing journey.
Amanda Durocher [00:01:24]:
Newviewadvice.com, and today's episode show notes will be at newviewadvice.com/90. So now let's jump in to talking about generational trauma. Hi. Firstly, I wanna thank you for the advice shared in your podcast, which has been incredibly beneficial to me in this past year. I'm curious if you've covered or plan to discuss a topic that I recently thought about inspired by the movie after son. It delves into a father's fear of passing on his depression to his child, something very common in parenting. Many parents carry unresolved traumas that can and do affect their children, and I wonder how we can cope with this without their trauma affecting us to the extent of unintentionally passing it on to the next generation. Thank you again for all the invaluable advice shared on your podcast.
Amanda Durocher [00:02:07]:
Thank you so much for this question, and thank you for your kind words about the podcast. I'm so grateful that you have found it beneficial on your own journey over the past year. That is why I do this. So thank you so much. I'm so grateful that it is helpful for you and for others. So thank you so much for this question. I think this is such a great question, and it's relevant for so many of us. What I hear you describing here is wanting to stop the cycles of generational trauma, and generational trauma is when the trauma from 1 generation continues to impact future generations.
Amanda Durocher [00:02:36]:
And so I think that this is such an important part of the healing journey for so many people. And I think that this is such a great question because when we're healing, we often have to confront how our parents and our families have impact us. And many times, that involves us looking at how their unresolved pain, wounding, and trauma has hurt us and even hurt other people within our family structure. I think a big part of healing is taking responsibility for our own lives, and many of us were not dealt a perfect hand. And what I mean by that is that we are all born into different circumstances, and they're not fair or evenly matched across humanity. We all know that. And so people are born into poverty, into classist systems. There's racist structures, into misogyny, into abusive households, into families with violence, into homes with sexual abusers, and the list goes on and on and on.
Amanda Durocher [00:03:18]:
And many times, these structures we're born into have impacted generations before us and are the result of generational trauma. And to me, trauma has a ripple effect, and generational trauma is one of those ripple effects. So I find when traumatic events happen, there's often a ripple. A picture dropping a rock into a lake, and that ripple is what trauma does. It not only ripples throughout your own life, but it ripples throughout the lives of those who surround you. And so many times, we're impacted by the wounds of the generations before us because if they haven't healed their trauma, many times those ripples continue to ripple out, for lack of a better word, into generations to come. And I love that in present day, we're talking about trauma. I know not everybody talks about trauma, but I love that this is a topic that I can talk about and, you know, people listen.
Amanda Durocher [00:04:03]:
But I think it's really important to note when talking about generational trauma that this was not always the case, and it has not always been this way. And there's a lot of people who have never done the inner work, who will never do the inner work, and especially the older generations. So, you know, I know that when my mom was my age, nobody had a podcast about trauma. And I know when her mom was my age, nobody even uttered the word trauma. So I just wanna mention that when healing generational trauma, it's really not about blaming the generations before us. It's about seeing that times are changing so we're able to change here in the present, and that that's okay. We're able to create different lives for ourselves, and we're able to change and create what I think is gonna be a more beautiful future because we're going to clear a lot of this trauma that has been plaguing so many of us for so many generations, but I think it's important to bring that compassionate view that it has not always been this way. We have not always been able to have these conversations.
Amanda Durocher [00:04:58]:
You know? I think a lot about the me too movement and how with me too that started in 2006 and how before that, people really weren't talking about how common sexual assault, rape, and sexual trauma were, but it was just as common before the me too movement. Right? So so many of our mothers, our grandmothers, our aunts, our family members, women and men, you know, a lot of men are sexually abused as children as well, have been impacted by sexual trauma, and we've just started having this conversation. And so I think with a lot of these topics and when generational trauma comes up, a lot of anger can come up because it's like, why am I healing something you didn't resolve? You know? I find anger to be one of the steps, but I also find it important to note that times are changing and that we're just in a different place as a society, and we're going to be in a new place in 10 years, in 20 years, in 30 years. And so it's just important to note that part of healing from trauma is accepting where we are, and we'll talk about that throughout the episode. So I wanna take a minute to just talk about generational trauma in general. So generational trauma, also known as intergenerational trauma and ancestral trauma, is when the impact of a traumatic event or experience is passed down from 1 generation to the next. So trauma often has a ripple effect like we talked about, and it impacts more than the person who directly experienced that trauma. So for example, in my life, when I was sexually assaulted, this trauma did not just impact me, but it impacted many other people in my life, including my parents, my brother, my partner, my friendships.
Amanda Durocher [00:06:21]:
It had a ripple effect. That is so common with all traumas. Another example would be the impact of racism on the lives of people of color. I'm white, so I don't wanna speak for people of color, but I think we can all agree that racism is traumatic, and it has a ripple effect. And the beliefs and traumatic events experienced by people of color are passed down through the generations. I've seen this to be true with my Jewish partner as well that the impact of antisemitism has been passed down through the generations impact is for women as well that living in a patriarchal world that puts men above women has had lasting impact on women, and the ways women cope with misogyny and sexism is passed down from 1 generation to the next generation. So when discussing generational trauma, it's often about seeing a bigger picture than our own individual experience. Reviewing how things came to be from a larger view rather than just our own small lens and personal experiences.
Amanda Durocher [00:07:16]:
An important thing to note when discussing generational trauma is that is often passed on because there is a lack of awareness around the trauma or maybe someone feels too much shame or self blame to seek help for the trauma. For example, I know survivors of sexual trauma can unknowingly pass on impacts of sexual trauma to their children, such as anxiety, panic, fear of strangers, or an untrusting nature. Or another example could be you had a physically abusive parent, and many people who are physically abusive were physically abused themselves. And when I think of abuse, I think that there's this energy of abuse, and it has 3 places it can go. So one is that the abuse can be passed on to another person. So, say, you were physically abused, you could physically start hitting somebody else, and then that energy is going somewhere. The second is that we become very self abusive ourselves. So I found this in my own life that when I was raped, I internalized that rape experience, and I became very, very self abusive.
Amanda Durocher [00:08:08]:
So that energy was continued throughout my own life of abuse. And the third thing we can do with abusive energy is that we can process the abuse of trauma we have experienced. I think trauma is a buzzword at this point, which I think is great that we're talking about trauma, but I think it can cause confusion. And I think trauma's often overcomplicated. To me, trauma is an event that feels threatening in nature that gets stuck in the body. So the trauma remains stuck until we process it. Many times, traumatic events put us in the stress response, fight, flight, freeze, or fawn, and we're not able to process it in the moment, so it becomes stuck. I like to think if we process the trauma close to the event, it doesn't need to impact our whole lives, but many people are not given the space to process it.
Amanda Durocher [00:08:52]:
Or, truthfully, they don't feel safe enough to process the trauma right after the event, so we live with it until we're ready to process it if ever. I mentioned this because generational trauma is created when 1 generation does not process the trauma, and so that trauma continues to impact them in future generations to come. I truthfully think everyone suffers from generational trauma to some degree or at least unhealthy generational patterns. An example I thought of when preparing for this episode is that my partner's grandfather was a Holocaust survivor, and we've discussed how some of the beliefs he carries and some of his experiences in the world may not actually be his own. And they're actually the result of having a family member live through such a horrific event, and that trauma impacted his grandfather and then impacted his mother and then has impacted him as well. But with that, I also don't think generational trauma has to be from such a large event or only focused on minorities. I'm not a minority. And both my parents grew up with their own traumas, though, and my parents had their own traumas that they were working through.
Amanda Durocher [00:09:51]:
And their parents had their own traumas and then were passed on to me, and I've carried some of the ways they coped, the beliefs they had about the world because of those traumas. And those are things that I've had to look at and heal in my own life. A great book I'm currently reading that discusses generational trauma is What My Bones Know by Stephanie Foo. This is a memoir about healing from CPTSD, which is complex PTSD, which is when somebody experiences chronic trauma. So, for example, repeated abuse or neglect in childhood. I don't have time to get into CPTSD today, but I found this book really helpful and insightful, and I think it really also talks about generational trauma as well. So now I wanna answer your question. How do we begin to create new familial patterns and stop the pattern of passing on trauma and unhealthy patterns and behaviors to future generations? So the truth is the only way to stop the pattern of generational trauma is to heal the trauma so that you are no longer burdened by it and cannot pass it on to the next generation.
Amanda Durocher [00:10:46]:
It's breaking the cycle or chain so that it will not continue. So many times people call people who are healing from generational trauma cycle breakers because you're breaking the cycle. Because many times, as I mentioned, these patterns in this trauma has been passed down for generations. Sometimes we're healing the results of our parents' trauma. Sometimes we're healing the impact of our grandparents' trauma or even further back. So it's important to note that when it comes to generational trauma, we're breaking a cycle because this cycle has been passed on through beliefs, through ways of being, through coping strategies, through the way your family sees the world and approaches the world. And so through healing generational trauma, we begin to break the cycle and disengage from the family structures that are not serving us. And an important thing to note is that healing isn't just doing the opposite of what your parents did.
Amanda Durocher [00:11:35]:
So I find that a lot of people are aware that they didn't like the way their parents parented them or they didn't like something about their childhood. And so when they have children, they tend to just swing to the opposite. So say you had a parent who neglected you, someone may swing and become an overbearing parent trying to give their child everything they didn't have or say you never got presents or never received any gifts you wanted as a child. Now you may give your child everything they've ever wanted. Or say your parents told you their feelings all the time, and it was too much for you. So you may try to hide your feelings from your children thinking that if you hide the bad from them, they won't feel how you felt. And I wanna mention this because true healing isn't just doing the opposite of what you experience. It's processing your pain and finding that the truth often lives somewhere in the middle and not in extremes.
Amanda Durocher [00:12:20]:
So many of us experience extremes in childhood. So with your example, say you had a depressed parent, and you had a parent who was very depressed and they were very open about their depression. You saw how depressed they were. When you have children, you may try to show that you're always okay. You may be like, I'm always fine. Mommy is always fine even though you're struggling because you're human. Right? So you're going to have good days and bad days. You're gonna have positive emotions and hard emotions.
Amanda Durocher [00:12:44]:
You're gonna feel good one day, maybe feel depressed another day. And what happens is a lot of times people will swing from one extreme to the other when, really, the truth is children deserve to see it all. So you don't wanna put your emotions on your children, but it's okay to express to a child, mommy's having a hard day. Everything's okay, but I'm just processing some hard feelings. So as we heal, we learn that truth often lives somewhere in the middle and doesn't usually live in extremes. I also wanna mention that healing generational trauma isn't easy. I've found it to be hard in my own life. It's a marathon, not a sprint, and I want you to remember that when healing, you are healing generations' worth of pain.
Amanda Durocher [00:13:20]:
So it's not supposed to happen overnight. So be kind and patient with yourself as you navigate these insights in your life. And since my advice for helping future generations is to heal and to be a cycle breaker in this generation, in your life, here are my 3 steps for healing generational trauma and the impact of parental wounds. The 3 steps are, 1, to bring awareness to how your parents have impacted you, 2, acceptance, and 3, allowing yourself to grieve and release any feelings of guilt, shame, and blame you may be carrying. So now I'm gonna talk more about each of these steps. So step number 1 is to bring awareness to how your parents have impacted you. So this step's all about starting to become aware of how you have been impacted by your parents, by your grandparents, by your family structure, maybe even by your culture, but it's about bringing awareness to where you may have gotten some of these beliefs or these behaviors that are not serving you. So in this step, you wanna look at the good, the bad, the ugly.
Amanda Durocher [00:14:17]:
You wanna look at everything. You wanna look at how your upbringing impacted who you are today. And then I want you to go 1 step further and see how this may have come to be that way. What was your parents' childhoods like? What were your grandparents' childhoods like? What did each generation experience? How are these experience passed on to future generations? Are you aware of any societal or cultural traumas that happen to 1 generation, and can you see the impacts of how that impacted that generation and then the next generation and the next? For example, in my own life, I know my parents experienced traumas in their childhoods. I'm not gonna go into details here. But one insight I have noticed is that in each of their families, my parents took on a lot of responsibility at a young age to cope with the traumas they experienced. So I found when I was a child, I was expected to act like they had. So for me, this included being taught that having feelings were childish, and I felt this pressure to grow up quickly when things were tough because that's what they were forced to do when they were children.
Amanda Durocher [00:15:14]:
And I can see that this is likely a belief they received from their childhoods and their parents and the traumas they experienced, and then they pass that on to me. And it's been through healing and seeing this trauma from an adult perspective that I've been able to heal it, and I hopefully won't pass it on to future generations. Another example I have would be from my partner, Evan. Since I met him, he's talked about how all is good until somebody comes to your door and takes away your freedom. And I thought this was a bit odd to have this fear of somebody just coming to your door and taking away your freedom. I never felt that way in my life. I didn't live with this fear. But through self exploration, Evan realizes that this was passed down to him through his own family because he had a grandfather who I mentioned was in the Holocaust and who was taken from his home, stripped of his rights, and thrown into slavery less than a 100 years ago.
Amanda Durocher [00:15:59]:
So, yeah, that leaves an impact on the family. So the belief that somebody's gonna come to your door and take away your freedoms was passed on unintentionally through his family. Even when I approached Evan about this originally, he didn't even realize how often he says that because many of these are so ingrained. I know one of my beliefs this isn't generational trauma, but I used to always say, don't bully me. Don't bully me. I wasn't even aware I was saying it, but the fear of being bullied was so ingrained. So when healing generational trauma, you may even want to ask somebody in your life if they notice a fear you have that you may not even be aware of. It may be helpful to get an outsider's perspective.
Amanda Durocher [00:16:35]:
Step 2 of the process is to begin to accept. It's acceptance. And what I mean by this is that we want to accept that we have been impacted by generational trauma. For some people, you may already accept it. But for a lot of people, this step is important because it's through looking at generational trauma, we begin to accept the real impact it has had on our life. When we grow up, we are all taught the importance of family and to respect our parents and our elders and that our parents know best and that they're taking care of us. When we're growing up, we accept this as how things are done. But many times as children, we can still feel that something isn't right.
Amanda Durocher [00:17:11]:
And when we grow up and we become adults and we're healing, a part of healing generational trauma is accepting that the pain we experience from our families was indeed painful and that that pain often goes back generations and has harmed us and impacted us. And, of course, you still love your family. You still love your parents, but part of healing generational trauma is understanding that your parents are just as human as you. And that when they were raising us and when they were raising you, they were doing the best they can. And if you're someone who has a lot of anger or hard feelings about your childhood, this can be hard to accept. But part of the acceptance stage is accepting that what happened to you wasn't acceptable, but you can still accept that it happened and choose to love your parents and your family. Many of our parents were impacted by generational trauma themselves and truly were doing the best they could with the maturity and emotional intelligence they had at the time. And by beginning to see the bigger picture of this generational trauma impact, we are able to begin accepting and healing.
Amanda Durocher [00:18:07]:
But for many people, it can be really hard to admit the impact our parents had. I know for me, I felt like I was fed a narrative my whole life. So I felt like how I viewed the world as a child was rewritten for me constantly. You know, I was constantly told that wasn't correct. That wasn't true. And so I began to not trust myself, and I began to deny my own reality in all honesty. Many of us live in a bit of denial about the impacts of generational trauma and parental wounds and how our parents have impacted us. So as we bring awareness to generational trauma and wounding, we begin to accept that it is real and that it has impacted us.
Amanda Durocher [00:18:42]:
And as we begin to accept and come out of denial, it's important to understand that everyone around you is not necessarily coming out of denial as well. This can be hard. When healing generational trauma, many times we wanna be like, oh my gosh. Do you see this? I see this. Can you see how this has impacted me, and it impacted you, and it impacted grandma? Not everybody's gonna wanna see it. You are seeing it. And breaking these family structures involves changing the status quo, bringing awareness to things that many have kept buried for a long time. And your parents may not like this.
Amanda Durocher [00:19:12]:
Your family may not like that doing this work, or they may not want to look at the things that you're looking at. They may deny that they were impacted the ways you see. They may not admit that they have unresolved trauma, and that does not make your experience untrue for you. Part of acceptance is validating your own experience. Healing from generational trauma can feel confusing because sometimes it's an isolating process. Sometimes you're the only one who's willing to look at it. It's why people are called cycle breakers. You're breaking a cycle that so many people have held on to, and people hold on to the impacts and the way they cope with trauma for various reasons.
Amanda Durocher [00:19:47]:
I think a main reason is often for safety, and it's the way they've found to feel safe in the world. And when you begin healing, we realize that some of these safety mechanisms or coping strategies that we have created no longer serve us. But as you heal, not everybody around you is going to be healing, so I just wanna mention that. And I also wanna say that I recently saw a movie that many of you have probably already seen, and it's called Everything Everywhere All at Once. I think it won the Oscar for best picture last year. And I thought this movie was a great movie. I really liked this movie, but it shows generational trauma and how the protagonist, how her relationship with her father impacts her and how that impacts her relationship with her daughter. And I thought it was a beautiful story of healing that impact.
Amanda Durocher [00:20:31]:
So if you're looking for a movie that kinda shows the impact of generational trauma in a fun way, I do recommend Everything Everywhere All at Once. And so as you bring awareness and you begin to accept the impact that this generational trauma has had on your life, many feelings are likely going to arise. And so this leads me to step number 3, which is to allow yourself to grieve and to release any feelings of guilt, shame, and blame you may be carrying. Generational trauma is hard to heal and takes time because it's a grieving process. So often, it involves leaving behind an old version of yourself for a more truthful one, for a more authentic one, and it involves grieving who we wanted our parents to be and who we thought our parents were and accepting that they are humans and that they very often weren't who we needed at the time. When we become adults, we really begin to see our parents in a new way. This is beautifully depicted in the movie after sun you mentioned in your question. And part of healing is seeing our parents for who they are, not who we want them to be.
Amanda Durocher [00:21:31]:
Grief is such an important step in healing generational trauma and generational burdens because you're going to move through the grieving process. The 5 stages of grief are denial, bargaining, anger, depression, and acceptance. And so when healing, we're really moving through that grief cycle because we are often denying the impact of the generational trauma. And then the bargaining is usually trying to tell ourselves, oh, it's it wasn't that bad. Oh, I'm overreacting. That's bargaining with ourselves. Then we get to anger. Oh my god.
Amanda Durocher [00:22:02]:
I am so angry at my parents, or I'm so angry at my grandparents, or I'm so angry that this trauma that happened has had an impact on me. I am so angry. Then we move into sadness and depression, and we cry about it. Oh my gosh. Oftentimes, we have to feel like a victim for a little bit. I can't believe I had to experience this. This was out of my control. And then we can move into that acceptance.
Amanda Durocher [00:22:26]:
This is a part of my past. This is a part of my life. I don't have to take this with me any further. I don't have to carry this burden anymore. I can accept that this is something I experienced, but I can choose new. And so grieving is a big part of healing generational trauma. Another emotion that's really common is guilt. So many of us will feel guilty when we are moving through this process because we've almost been carrying the burdens of our ancestors or of our parents.
Amanda Durocher [00:22:54]:
And by healing it, I really mentally viewed it over and over again, handing the burden back over. This is not mine. This is yours. Handing it over. And I would visualize myself handing it back to my parents or to my grandparents, whatever was arising at the time. But I would feel guilty because I had been carrying that burden for so long. But the truth is with guilt is that we have to free ourselves of the guilt because this isn't yours to carry anymore. So many times we create the belief that if we act a certain way or if we carry a burden, that we're helping others.
Amanda Durocher [00:23:27]:
We're not because who you're not helping in that situation is you, and you deserve to be free. And you have the same tools that your mom has, that your dad has, and that other people have. Everyone has the option to heal. Not everybody's gonna choose it, but it is an option for everyone. And it's part of the journey to take responsibility for our own lives, and part of that is that we take responsibility for what's ours to heal, and we give back what's not ours. You don't have to feel guilty for healing. Guilt also often arises because when we're healing, we can become more mature than our parents. We can feel like we're more of an adult than them because they can be stuck in a child pattern, and we can feel guilty when we can see this and when we feel this.
Amanda Durocher [00:24:08]:
Guilt is a hard emotion to process. Personally, I felt a lot of guilt when healing generational trauma. And what I found was just allowing guilt up brought a lot of tears. And just over time, the more I allowed myself to sit with that guilt, to see that guilt, to forgive that guilt what I mean by forgiveness is to let go of that guilt, to see that though that was a very real experience I was having, I didn't have to feel that way over and over again. The guilt dissipated. It just took time. It wasn't an overnight process. I think guilt also arises because we don't want to see the pain our parents caused us.
Amanda Durocher [00:24:43]:
We feel guilty for even seeing it. I know for me in my life, I kept minimizing the amount of pain I felt, especially because I'd been told over and over again that I was wrong about the pain I experienced, so it was very confusing to heal. But part of the healing journey and learning to trust ourselves is to trust ourselves. Right? Is to trust how you feel. Is to trust what arises. Is to trust that child self within you, your inner child, and the emotions, feelings, beliefs, and memories that arise. And though guilt is a common emotion, it will pass. All these emotions, this grief, this anger, this guilt, the shame, the blame, they all will pass.
Amanda Durocher [00:25:18]:
You just have to create the space to allow these feelings up. And how do you do this? How do you lie your feelings up? You meditate. You journal. You find a safe space to talk about it. I think that therapy can be helpful for this because it can be helpful to find somebody outside your family to help you to see the situation more clearly. Many times, if we try to talk about how we're feeling within our family structure, a distorted view of reality will be mirrored back to us. But when we invite an outside perspective in such as a therapist, a coach, a guide, a close friend, maybe your partner, your husband, your wife, you invite them to see it with you with an open mind, then we can begin to see the situation more clearly. And so these are the 3 steps I have for healing generational trauma, to bring awareness, to begin accepting, and to feel your feelings.
Amanda Durocher [00:26:05]:
So my recommendation is to repeat these steps as necessary and to allow yourself to feel a lot of compassion for yourself. And the more compassion you feel towards yourself, the more it will ripple out, and you'll have compassion for your parents, your grandparents, and your ancestors. At the end of the day, I always think compassion helps to make everything a little bit easier, learning to be kind to ourselves, learning we're human, learning we make mistakes, learning our parents made mistakes. And the more compassion we can bring to ourselves, to others, and to the world, I think the easier a lot of this healing journey can be. That's why I talk about it all the time. So thank you so much for this question. I hope something in this answer was helpful. Sending you all my love.
Amanda Durocher [00:26:46]:
Thanks again for joining me for today's episode, and I hope you enjoyed talking about generational trauma and the impact generational trauma can have on us and future generations and how to heal that generational trauma through awareness, acceptance, and feeling our feelings. If you enjoyed this episode and you haven't already, I invite you to leave a 5 star rating and a review. Please hit that subscribe button at the top on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to these podcast episodes. It's really helpful for me to continue making more episodes and to continue talking about the healing journey. Thanks again for joining me for another episode of Doobie Advice. As always, I hope I was able to offer you a new view on whatever you may be going through. Sending you all my love. See you next time.